Comments on: Could we have a friggin’ Conservative Party please?

By: gene berman

gene berman — Sat, 18 Jul 2009 00:58:18 +0000

Newmania:

At best, you may be next-best. The good taste called modesty prevents me from identifying your better.

By: Thomas Byrne

Thomas Byrne — Fri, 17 Jul 2009 18:36:38 +0000

I wrote a similar piece on my blog referencing you, it’s fucking crazy.

By: Johnathan Pearce

Johnathan Pearce — Thu, 16 Jul 2009 13:53:03 +0000

I am a bit surprised that Ian B had a nice(ish) thing to say about Mrs T. On another blog, he seemed to argue that Mrs Thatcher is responsible for today’s Big State, or that at least her vaunted achievements in privatising state businesses etc were overblown. Sean Gabb of the Libertarian Alliance has made a similar sort of point.

By: Bruno Prior

Bruno Prior — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 22:19:23 +0000

When a child is injured or killed because they couldn’t get away fast enough on foot nor ring for help, how will Mr Grayling look? I imagine this is grandstanding to sound tough and he will probably quietly forget about it once he finds the on-switch for his brain.

By: Newmania

Newmania — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 20:23:23 +0000

If John B could think of black and gay people as primarily people and not victim props for his “Look -how-fucking-great-I-am” one man show , then he would be less confused .
Saint M turned the tide of the state back for us all.

By: David Gillies

David Gillies — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 16:32:39 +0000

Mind you, I’m all for seeing troublesome little scrotes suffer, after due process of law. Garnishing benefits is the way I’d do it, rather than confiscation of property. Easy to impose, easy to collect, nothing to be handed back at the end. You’d probably want to steer clear of the muppets who implemented the CPAs systems, though.

By: john b

john b — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 13:04:51 +0000

Pleased to see the general consensus here re Tory authoritarianism. Although Ian B’s suuggestion that Mrs Thatcher was for individual rights (or at least, for individual rights for people who weren’t white, middle-class, straight and married) is a bit odd.

By: Tristan

Tristan — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 12:37:10 +0000

The Tories may have been the opposition to Marxist derived collectivism, but they have always been a nationalist collectivist party to some degree.
Nationalism and maintenance of privilege for landlords and business have always been at the core of Tory policy.

By: JuliaM

JuliaM — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 11:56:46 +0000

“Reminds me of New Labour!”

No, no! Totally different parties.

One has a green tree logo, one has a red rose.

And…

Errr…

Ok, that’s about it.

By: dearieme

dearieme — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 11:07:11 +0000

I know a woman who thinks that the lower orders shouldn’t be allowed mobile phones because they overspend on the calls. She is, of course, a Labour Party person.

By: Matthew Cain

Matthew Cain — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 10:17:55 +0000

There’s a pretty robust response from Frances Crook of the Howard League. She seems to think it’s just headline-chasing:

http://www.howardleague.org/francescrookblog/headline-grabbing

Reminds me of New Labour!

By: Newmania

Newmania — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 09:25:11 +0000

Conservatism in Britain (well, England, it’s never really existed in the Celtic Dependencies) is a philosophy of interventionist government and always has been. Anyone

Ian that’s rather simplistic , the Conservative Party has certainly been the effective defence of individual rights for most of the 20th century as the principle opposition to Marxist derived collectivism .Post Thatcher it has also been strongly influenced by Libertarian American thinking such as Hayek (plonk …) ; that Hayek did not like Conservatives is of course a problem and has a deep meaning . Small c conservatism , also represented in the party , is a philosophy which has nothing to do with Liberal thought, on many levels . It is pessimistic about men, their ability to think up solutions , their likely behaviour in conditions of anarchy , universal solutions in general, and utopianisms especially .It seeks a balance between change and built up value in institutions , nations etc. erring on the cautious side .

In this sense there is nothing un-conservative about updating the coppers clip around the ear , it is quintessentially conservative . If Timmy wishes people to be free to have their windows smashed and children knifed by feral youth the it is a freedom I have no interest in. Many conservatives like me , hold both traditions in what I like to think of as creative dissonance .This nuanced complex truth is in contrast to the plodding scaffolding of the left and the Libetarian zealot .

That is why I am best

By: Kay Tie

Kay Tie — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 09:02:42 +0000

“That’s the British way, and it always has been.”

Oh yes, that’s true. It’s almost comical to watch people who say things like “foreign policy with an ethic dimension” subsume slowly into the British Government that has been in power since the 1700s.

By: Kay Tie

Kay Tie — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 08:59:26 +0000

Why not simply frogmarch them to a cash machine to pay the err.. oh, right.

By: Ian B

Ian B — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 08:48:48 +0000

Look, I hate having to keep saying this, but the Conservative Party is not, and never has been, a liberal/libertarian/individualist/whatever party. It is a statist party with a bias towards business and the neuroses of the middle classes, as opposed to New Labour, who are a statist party with a bias towards business and the neuroses of the middle classes (who replaced Labour, a statist party with a bias towards unions and the neuroses of the working classes).

Conservatism in Britain (well, England, it’s never really existed in the Celtic Dependencies) is a philosophy of interventionist government and always has been. Anyone expecting some kind of liberal swerve from the Tories is always disappointed, except arguably during a brief uncharacteristic period when they let some uppity woman run the party who had to be got rid of when she dared criticise the EU.

The Tories believe in a government with absolute power over everything within the nation’s borders, same as the other two parties. Your mobile phone belongs to them, well, to them on the Queen’s behalf or something, and you are allowed to use it if you’re good. That’s the British way, and it always has been.

By: JuliaM

JuliaM — Wed, 15 Jul 2009 08:23:48 +0000

“Does the Conservative Party no longer stand for the sanctity of private property?”

Of course not. It stands for getting itself into power, any way, any how.